U***@web.de
2019-05-26 10:39:19 UTC
Discussion:
(too old to reply)
h***@yahoo.co.uk
2019-05-27 21:55:06 UTC
Post by U***@web.de
Hello,
see https://railturkey.org/2019/05/25/plovdiv-edirne-train-to-start/
Regards, ULF
I also saw that Baku-Tbilisi-Kars is due to start carrying passengers inHello,
see https://railturkey.org/2019/05/25/plovdiv-edirne-train-to-start/
Regards, ULF
August.
It makes me wonder why the Baltic States and EU are investing very large
sums into the construction of Rail Baltica. Would it not be easier and
more economical, to rebuild and expand existing infrastructure and allow
for variable-gauge axles, rather than build an entirely separate network?
Recliner
2019-05-27 22:00:31 UTC
Post by h***@yahoo.co.uk
August.
It makes me wonder why the Baltic States and EU are investing very large
sums into the construction of Rail Baltica. Would it not be easier and
more economical, to rebuild and expand existing infrastructure and allow
for variable-gauge axles, rather than build an entirely separate network?
I thought the problem with the Baltic states' railways was that theirPost by U***@web.de
Hello,
see https://railturkey.org/2019/05/25/plovdiv-edirne-train-to-start/
Regards, ULF
I also saw that Baku-Tbilisi-Kars is due to start carrying passengers inHello,
see https://railturkey.org/2019/05/25/plovdiv-edirne-train-to-start/
Regards, ULF
August.
It makes me wonder why the Baltic States and EU are investing very large
sums into the construction of Rail Baltica. Would it not be easier and
more economical, to rebuild and expand existing infrastructure and allow
for variable-gauge axles, rather than build an entirely separate network?
networks radiated from St Petersburg, rather than having north-south links
to Poland?
h***@yahoo.co.uk
2019-05-27 23:44:49 UTC
Post by Recliner
networks radiated from St Petersburg, rather than having north-south links
to Poland?
They do, but they also have a north-south connection.Post by h***@yahoo.co.uk
August.
It makes me wonder why the Baltic States and EU are investing very large
sums into the construction of Rail Baltica. Would it not be easier and
more economical, to rebuild and expand existing infrastructure and allow
for variable-gauge axles, rather than build an entirely separate network?
I thought the problem with the Baltic states' railways was that theirPost by U***@web.de
Hello,
see https://railturkey.org/2019/05/25/plovdiv-edirne-train-to-start/
Regards, ULF
I also saw that Baku-Tbilisi-Kars is due to start carrying passengers inHello,
see https://railturkey.org/2019/05/25/plovdiv-edirne-train-to-start/
Regards, ULF
August.
It makes me wonder why the Baltic States and EU are investing very large
sums into the construction of Rail Baltica. Would it not be easier and
more economical, to rebuild and expand existing infrastructure and allow
for variable-gauge axles, rather than build an entirely separate network?
networks radiated from St Petersburg, rather than having north-south links
to Poland?
There used to be the Baltic Express, which ran from Tallinn to Warsaw
with a change at Šeštokai.
AIUI, there was a second connection between Poland and Lithuania, which
required the use of a variable-gauge axle. I don't know if the
now-standard-gauge line on the Lithuanian side was that.
AIAUI, each of the lines into Lithuania are single-track, and that is
where real work needs to occurr.
U***@web.de
2019-05-28 08:38:07 UTC
Post by h***@yahoo.co.uk
Which was not used for public passenger service during Siviet times.Post by Recliner
I thought the problem with the Baltic states' railways was that their
networks radiated from St Petersburg, rather than having north-south links
to Poland?
They do, but they also have a north-south connection.I thought the problem with the Baltic states' railways was that their
networks radiated from St Petersburg, rather than having north-south links
to Poland?
That was Balti. https://www.russianrail.com/train-tallinn-st-petersburg-moscow.html
Not to be confounded with the Baltic Express.
https://www.russianrail.com/train-tallinn-st-petersburg-moscow.html
There was a through service via Kuźnica Białostocka and Grodno
about 1990/92 but Transit visa were needed for most of
the passengers.
Post by h***@yahoo.co.uk
AIUI, there was a second connection between Poland and Lithuania, which
required the use of a variable-gauge axle. I don't know if the
now-standard-gauge line on the Lithuanian side was that.
AIAUI, each of the lines into Lithuania are single-track,
Don't think so. Gudogay to Chernyahovsk is shown asAIUI, there was a second connection between Poland and Lithuania, which
required the use of a variable-gauge axle. I don't know if the
now-standard-gauge line on the Lithuanian side was that.
AIAUI, each of the lines into Lithuania are single-track,
double track on Loading Image...
(a bit outdated).
Regards, ULF
h***@yahoo.co.uk
2019-05-29 00:10:07 UTC
Post by U***@web.de
So, during the Soviet occupation, there was no direct rail servicePost by h***@yahoo.co.uk
Which was not used for public passenger service during Siviet times.Post by Recliner
I thought the problem with the Baltic states' railways was that their
networks radiated from St Petersburg, rather than having north-south links
to Poland?
They do, but they also have a north-south connection.I thought the problem with the Baltic states' railways was that their
networks radiated from St Petersburg, rather than having north-south links
to Poland?
between Tallinn and Riga as well as between Riga and Vilnius?
Post by U***@web.de
That was Balti. https://www.russianrail.com/train-tallinn-st-petersburg-moscow.html
Are you referring EVR's GO train, which runs between Tallinn and St.That was Balti. https://www.russianrail.com/train-tallinn-st-petersburg-moscow.html
Petersburg/Moscow?
There was also a Baltic Express train, which ran from Tallinn to Warsaw
in about 1993, requiring a transfer to a standard-gauge, PKP train at
Šeštokai.
Post by U***@web.de
double track on https://www.parovoz.com/maps/supermap/supermap-small.png
(a bit outdated).
I was talking about current rail connections between Poland and Lithuania.Post by h***@yahoo.co.uk
AIUI, there was a second connection between Poland and Lithuania, which
required the use of a variable-gauge axle. I don't know if the
now-standard-gauge line on the Lithuanian side was that.
AIAUI, each of the lines into Lithuania are single-track,
Don't think so. Gudogay to Chernyahovsk is shown asAIUI, there was a second connection between Poland and Lithuania, which
required the use of a variable-gauge axle. I don't know if the
now-standard-gauge line on the Lithuanian side was that.
AIAUI, each of the lines into Lithuania are single-track,
double track on https://www.parovoz.com/maps/supermap/supermap-small.png
(a bit outdated).
U***@web.de
2019-05-30 13:14:13 UTC
Post by h***@yahoo.co.uk
between Tallinn and Riga as well as between Riga and Vilnius?
Which of them used "north-south links to Poland"?Post by U***@web.de
So, during the Soviet occupation, there was no direct rail servicePost by h***@yahoo.co.uk
Which was not used for public passenger service during Siviet times.Post by Recliner
I thought the problem with the Baltic states' railways was that their
networks radiated from St Petersburg, rather than having north-south links
to Poland?
They do, but they also have a north-south connection.I thought the problem with the Baltic states' railways was that their
networks radiated from St Petersburg, rather than having north-south links
to Poland?
between Tallinn and Riga as well as between Riga and Vilnius?
Well, the Tallin - Riga - Vilnius - Grodno - Warsaw service
used a north-south link to Poland but the one one the
Piter - Daugavpils - Warsaw line.
Post by h***@yahoo.co.uk
Petersburg/Moscow?
There was also a Baltic Express train, which ran from Tallinn to Warsaw
in about 1993, requiring a transfer to a standard-gauge, PKP train at
Šeštokai.
IIRC, it was Balti without 'c'.Post by U***@web.de
That was Balti. https://www.russianrail.com/train-tallinn-st-petersburg-moscow.html
Are you referring EVR's GO train, which runs between Tallinn and St.That was Balti. https://www.russianrail.com/train-tallinn-st-petersburg-moscow.html
Petersburg/Moscow?
There was also a Baltic Express train, which ran from Tallinn to Warsaw
in about 1993, requiring a transfer to a standard-gauge, PKP train at
Šeštokai.
h***@yahoo.co.uk
2019-05-30 14:13:25 UTC
Post by U***@web.de
I wasn't talking about links to Poland when the Baltic States were underPost by h***@yahoo.co.uk
between Tallinn and Riga as well as between Riga and Vilnius?
Which of them used "north-south links to Poland"?Post by U***@web.de
So, during the Soviet occupation, there was no direct rail servicePost by h***@yahoo.co.uk
Which was not used for public passenger service during Siviet times.Post by Recliner
I thought the problem with the Baltic states' railways was that their
networks radiated from St Petersburg, rather than having north-south links
to Poland?
They do, but they also have a north-south connection.I thought the problem with the Baltic states' railways was that their
networks radiated from St Petersburg, rather than having north-south links
to Poland?
between Tallinn and Riga as well as between Riga and Vilnius?
Soviet occupation, but rather asking about passenger rail between
Vilnius-Riga-Tallinn in that time.
Post by U***@web.de
Well, the Tallin - Riga - Vilnius - Grodno - Warsaw service
used a north-south link to Poland but the one one the
Piter - Daugavpils - Warsaw line.
Balti Express?Well, the Tallin - Riga - Vilnius - Grodno - Warsaw service
used a north-south link to Poland but the one one the
Piter - Daugavpils - Warsaw line.
Post by h***@yahoo.co.uk
Petersburg/Moscow?
There was also a Baltic Express train, which ran from Tallinn to Warsaw
in about 1993, requiring a transfer to a standard-gauge, PKP train at
Šeštokai.
IIRC, it was Balti without 'c'.Post by U***@web.de
That was Balti. https://www.russianrail.com/train-tallinn-st-petersburg-moscow.html
Are you referring EVR's GO train, which runs between Tallinn and St.That was Balti. https://www.russianrail.com/train-tallinn-st-petersburg-moscow.html
Petersburg/Moscow?
There was also a Baltic Express train, which ran from Tallinn to Warsaw
in about 1993, requiring a transfer to a standard-gauge, PKP train at
Šeštokai.
Why did they cut that service in any event, no passenger volumes?
U***@web.de
2019-05-30 14:21:26 UTC
Post by h***@yahoo.co.uk
Soviet occupation, but rather asking about passenger rail between
Vilnius-Riga-Tallinn in that time.
Did you find an answer?Post by U***@web.de
I wasn't talking about links to Poland when the Baltic States were underPost by h***@yahoo.co.uk
between Tallinn and Riga as well as between Riga and Vilnius?
Which of them used "north-south links to Poland"?Post by U***@web.de
So, during the Soviet occupation, there was no direct rail servicePost by h***@yahoo.co.uk
Which was not used for public passenger service during Siviet times.Post by Recliner
I thought the problem with the Baltic states' railways was that their
networks radiated from St Petersburg, rather than having north-south links
to Poland?
They do, but they also have a north-south connection.I thought the problem with the Baltic states' railways was that their
networks radiated from St Petersburg, rather than having north-south links
to Poland?
between Tallinn and Riga as well as between Riga and Vilnius?
Soviet occupation, but rather asking about passenger rail between
Vilnius-Riga-Tallinn in that time.
Post by U***@web.de
Well, the Tallin - Riga - Vilnius - Grodno - Warsaw service
used a north-south link to Poland but the one one the
Piter - Daugavpils - Warsaw line.
Well, the Tallin - Riga - Vilnius - Grodno - Warsaw service
used a north-south link to Poland but the one one the
Piter - Daugavpils - Warsaw line.
h***@yahoo.co.uk
2019-05-30 14:23:29 UTC
Post by U***@web.de
About passenger rail connections between Vilnius-Riga-Tallinn? I did not.Post by h***@yahoo.co.uk
Soviet occupation, but rather asking about passenger rail between
Vilnius-Riga-Tallinn in that time.
Did you find an answer?Post by U***@web.de
I wasn't talking about links to Poland when the Baltic States were underPost by h***@yahoo.co.uk
between Tallinn and Riga as well as between Riga and Vilnius?
Which of them used "north-south links to Poland"?Post by U***@web.de
So, during the Soviet occupation, there was no direct rail servicePost by h***@yahoo.co.uk
Which was not used for public passenger service during Siviet times.Post by Recliner
I thought the problem with the Baltic states' railways was that their
networks radiated from St Petersburg, rather than having north-south links
to Poland?
They do, but they also have a north-south connection.I thought the problem with the Baltic states' railways was that their
networks radiated from St Petersburg, rather than having north-south links
to Poland?
between Tallinn and Riga as well as between Riga and Vilnius?
Soviet occupation, but rather asking about passenger rail between
Vilnius-Riga-Tallinn in that time.
Post by U***@web.de
Well, the Tallin - Riga - Vilnius - Grodno - Warsaw service
used a north-south link to Poland but the one one the
Piter - Daugavpils - Warsaw line.
Well, the Tallin - Riga - Vilnius - Grodno - Warsaw service
used a north-south link to Poland but the one one the
Piter - Daugavpils - Warsaw line.
An older SZhD would ideally help, though I also don't read Russian.
U***@web.de
2019-05-30 15:01:35 UTC
Post by h***@yahoo.co.uk
Big problem for you if it was Warsaw - Vilnius - Riga - Tallinn?Post by U***@web.de
About passenger rail connections between Vilnius-Riga-Tallinn? I did not.Post by h***@yahoo.co.uk
Soviet occupation, but rather asking about passenger rail between
Vilnius-Riga-Tallinn in that time.
Did you find an answer?Post by U***@web.de
I wasn't talking about links to Poland when the Baltic States were underPost by h***@yahoo.co.uk
between Tallinn and Riga as well as between Riga and Vilnius?
Which of them used "north-south links to Poland"?Post by U***@web.de
So, during the Soviet occupation, there was no direct rail servicePost by h***@yahoo.co.uk
Which was not used for public passenger service during Siviet times.Post by Recliner
I thought the problem with the Baltic states' railways was that their
networks radiated from St Petersburg, rather than having north-south links
to Poland?
They do, but they also have a north-south connection.I thought the problem with the Baltic states' railways was that their
networks radiated from St Petersburg, rather than having north-south links
to Poland?
between Tallinn and Riga as well as between Riga and Vilnius?
Soviet occupation, but rather asking about passenger rail between
Vilnius-Riga-Tallinn in that time.
Post by U***@web.de
Well, the Tallin - Riga - Vilnius - Grodno - Warsaw service
used a north-south link to Poland but the one one the
Piter - Daugavpils - Warsaw line.
Well, the Tallin - Riga - Vilnius - Grodno - Warsaw service
used a north-south link to Poland but the one one the
Piter - Daugavpils - Warsaw line.
188/187 trains ran Tallinn <-> Minsk.
The through car Tallinn <-> Vilnius <-> Warsaw
https://rail-club.ru/forum/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=10368&start=120#p108700
ran on a regular basis in later years.
h***@yahoo.co.uk
2019-05-30 15:57:43 UTC
Post by U***@web.de
Not in the least.Post by h***@yahoo.co.uk
Big problem for you if it was Warsaw - Vilnius - Riga - Tallinn?Post by U***@web.de
About passenger rail connections between Vilnius-Riga-Tallinn? I did not.Post by h***@yahoo.co.uk
Soviet occupation, but rather asking about passenger rail between
Vilnius-Riga-Tallinn in that time.
Did you find an answer?Post by U***@web.de
I wasn't talking about links to Poland when the Baltic States were underPost by h***@yahoo.co.uk
between Tallinn and Riga as well as between Riga and Vilnius?
Which of them used "north-south links to Poland"?Post by U***@web.de
So, during the Soviet occupation, there was no direct rail servicePost by h***@yahoo.co.uk
Which was not used for public passenger service during Siviet times.Post by Recliner
I thought the problem with the Baltic states' railways was that their
networks radiated from St Petersburg, rather than having north-south links
to Poland?
They do, but they also have a north-south connection.I thought the problem with the Baltic states' railways was that their
networks radiated from St Petersburg, rather than having north-south links
to Poland?
between Tallinn and Riga as well as between Riga and Vilnius?
Soviet occupation, but rather asking about passenger rail between
Vilnius-Riga-Tallinn in that time.
Post by U***@web.de
Well, the Tallin - Riga - Vilnius - Grodno - Warsaw service
used a north-south link to Poland but the one one the
Piter - Daugavpils - Warsaw line.
Well, the Tallin - Riga - Vilnius - Grodno - Warsaw service
used a north-south link to Poland but the one one the
Piter - Daugavpils - Warsaw line.
Was the Warsaw - Vilnius - Riga - Tallinn service the only real
passenger service between the three cities under Soviet occupation?
h***@yahoo.co.uk
2019-05-29 09:42:25 UTC
Post by Recliner
networks radiated from St Petersburg, rather than having north-south links
to Poland?
Tallinn's radiates from St. Petersburg, I would say, whereas Riga isPost by h***@yahoo.co.uk
August.
It makes me wonder why the Baltic States and EU are investing very large
sums into the construction of Rail Baltica. Would it not be easier and
more economical, to rebuild and expand existing infrastructure and allow
for variable-gauge axles, rather than build an entirely separate network?
I thought the problem with the Baltic states' railways was that theirPost by U***@web.de
Hello,
see https://railturkey.org/2019/05/25/plovdiv-edirne-train-to-start/
Regards, ULF
I also saw that Baku-Tbilisi-Kars is due to start carrying passengers inHello,
see https://railturkey.org/2019/05/25/plovdiv-edirne-train-to-start/
Regards, ULF
August.
It makes me wonder why the Baltic States and EU are investing very large
sums into the construction of Rail Baltica. Would it not be easier and
more economical, to rebuild and expand existing infrastructure and allow
for variable-gauge axles, rather than build an entirely separate network?
networks radiated from St Petersburg, rather than having north-south links
to Poland?
likely to have a more direct connection with Moscow.
Lithuania shares no border with mainland Russia.
Arthur Figgis
2019-05-29 18:26:37 UTC
But it does have a border with Russia, which has swapped sides of the
frontier line from when the same border was the Russia-Germany border:
http://pillandia.blogspot.com/2012/10/de-ru-1906.html
frontier line from when the same border was the Russia-Germany border:
http://pillandia.blogspot.com/2012/10/de-ru-1906.html
--
Arthur Figgis Surrey, UK
Arthur Figgis Surrey, UK
U***@web.de
2019-05-28 08:28:05 UTC
Post by h***@yahoo.co.uk
It makes me wonder why the Baltic States and EU are investing very large
sums into the construction of Rail Baltica. Would it not be easier and
more economical, to rebuild and expand existing infrastructure and allow
for variable-gauge axles,
For all passenger and freight trains? Those cars cannot freely circulateIt makes me wonder why the Baltic States and EU are investing very large
sums into the construction of Rail Baltica. Would it not be easier and
more economical, to rebuild and expand existing infrastructure and allow
for variable-gauge axles,
in Europe, by the way.
IIRC, Kazlu Ruda - Sestokai was just rebuilt and regauged.
Regards, ULF
Arthur Figgis
2019-05-28 17:39:25 UTC
Post by h***@yahoo.co.uk
It makes me wonder why the Baltic States and EU are investing very large
sums into the construction of Rail Baltica. Would it not be easier and
more economical, to rebuild and expand existing infrastructure and allow
for variable-gauge axles, rather than build an entirely separate network?
That requires a captive fleet of trains, which is do-able for passengerIt makes me wonder why the Baltic States and EU are investing very large
sums into the construction of Rail Baltica. Would it not be easier and
more economical, to rebuild and expand existing infrastructure and allow
for variable-gauge axles, rather than build an entirely separate network?
services, but awkward for freight. And perhaps if you are going to build
a new line for modern standards and speeds, and the point is to
re-orient transport and political geography towards Warsaw, Berlin and
Brussels rather than St Petersburg or Moscow, and Hard-Working
[British/German] Families(tm) are paying, why not build standard gauge?
Does Rail Baltica actually make much sense as a transport project,
rather than a geopolitical one? If I lived there I'd probably want to
know that flat wagons carrying heavy loads from NATO depots could arrive
quickly rather than get stuck at a break of gauge, but is there much
passenger and freight demand for normal services?
--
Arthur Figgis Surrey, UK
Philipp Klaus Krause
2019-06-05 11:16:46 UTC
Post by Arthur Figgis
Does Rail Baltica actually make much sense as a transport project,
rather than a geopolitical one? If I lived there I'd probably want to
know that flat wagons carrying heavy loads from NATO depots could arrive
quickly rather than get stuck at a break of gauge, but is there much
passenger and freight demand for normal services?
I don't think it would make sense for passenger transport only. However,Does Rail Baltica actually make much sense as a transport project,
rather than a geopolitical one? If I lived there I'd probably want to
know that flat wagons carrying heavy loads from NATO depots could arrive
quickly rather than get stuck at a break of gauge, but is there much
passenger and freight demand for normal services?
the terrain is flat, so building it as a 240 km/h high speed line
doesn't come at much additional cost and makes sense (similarly to how
Sweden built some new lines for 250 km/h, even where there is mostly
freight traffic).
It probably is worth it for freight. The baltic states still have a very
high rail freight transport market share (far higher than the rest of
the EU), but it is declining. There is trade with the rest of the EU,
and the long distances make rail freight particularly competitive to
road transport. Iproving rail connections to the EU would help stop the
rail freight decline in the baltic states.
Philipp
U***@web.de
2019-05-31 07:23:06 UTC
Official information:
http://www.bdz.bg/bg/international/plovdiv-odrin-plovdiv.html
http://p.bdz.bg/p/l/plovdiv-edirne-plovdiv-01062019-12525.pdf
Regards, ULF
http://www.bdz.bg/bg/international/plovdiv-odrin-plovdiv.html
http://p.bdz.bg/p/l/plovdiv-edirne-plovdiv-01062019-12525.pdf
Regards, ULF
U***@web.de
2019-06-11 10:58:16 UTC
Now they say on June 1st, 2nd were test runs,
they are waiting for introducing Sofia <-> Edirne.
Looks like the trains already have been discontinued before last weekend.
http://www.bdz.bg/bg/novini/izgotviat-se-varianti-vlakut-do-odrin-da-trugva-ot-sofiia.html
Regards, ULF
they are waiting for introducing Sofia <-> Edirne.
Looks like the trains already have been discontinued before last weekend.
http://www.bdz.bg/bg/novini/izgotviat-se-varianti-vlakut-do-odrin-da-trugva-ot-sofiia.html
Regards, ULF
h***@yahoo.co.uk
2019-06-12 00:34:23 UTC
Post by U***@web.de
Now they say on June 1st, 2nd were test runs,
they are waiting for introducing Sofia <-> Edirne.
Looks like the trains already have been discontinued before last weekend.
http://www.bdz.bg/bg/novini/izgotviat-se-varianti-vlakut-do-odrin-da-trugva-ot-sofiia.html
Regards, ULF
I've not visited Bulgaria, but can you tell me what the current state ofNow they say on June 1st, 2nd were test runs,
they are waiting for introducing Sofia <-> Edirne.
Looks like the trains already have been discontinued before last weekend.
http://www.bdz.bg/bg/novini/izgotviat-se-varianti-vlakut-do-odrin-da-trugva-ot-sofiia.html
Regards, ULF
BDZh is?
Have you visited there?